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Post by nyspaceman on Aug 12, 2007 0:43:53 GMT -5
What if this film is as much a religious parable as it is a hard-won celebration of the human will to survive? My interpretation of the ending is this:
Capa and Cassie become a New Adam and a New Eve, and Pinbacker a New Serpent. Unlike the originals, they are not fooled by the lies and delusions of the latter, instead choosing, fighting for, and, ultimately, renewing life.
Additionally, Capa becomes Christ, and Pinbacker the Antichrist. In my mind, nothing makes this more obvious than that it seems Pinbacker was able to infect his crew with his fatalism, leading them to their mass suicide, like the false messiah of Revelations. Slithering aboard the Icarus II, he again attempts to undermine life, but this time is stopped by his positive and absolute opposite, Capa.
In both cases, Capa and Cassie understood that one truly lives by knowing how to properly die (and, one hopes, vice versa). This truth eluded Pinbacker, who was taken in by the madness of Satan, a dark force that wears many appealing masks, even the mask of God. Capa and Cassie revere life, and as a result, are unknowingly acting upon true and sincere faith; Pinbacker, on the other hand, has succumbed to the idolatry of death-worship. Indeed, in a wider sense, the crews of the two ships reflect this division, for those of the Icarus II (even Harvey to an extent) were willing to sacrifice themselves to save earth, while their predecessors aboard the Icarus I surrendered to irrational despair.
Thus, the ending is not simply about future-oriented and hopeful rationalism overcoming a medieval and pessimistic mysticism. It is actually a revelation of the true will of God: that this life, though it may be a hard roll, is worth dying for.
Everyone's thoughts?
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Post by nimue on Aug 12, 2007 1:48:37 GMT -5
That was pretty deep. I have never thought of it that way before but now that you mention it, it can be interpreted that way.
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spc
Trainee
In order to save humanity, must we lose our own?
Posts: 6
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Post by spc on Aug 12, 2007 16:40:36 GMT -5
Additionally, Capa becomes Christ, and Pinbacker the Antichrist. In my mind, nothing makes this more obvious than that it seems Pinbacker was able to infect his crew with his fatalism, leading them to their mass suicide, like the false messiah of Revelations. That's an interesting take on the death of the (three) Icarus I crew members. (I say "three" since I could not see any more charred corpses when I watched the film a second time.) I agree that it was probably an act of suicide on their part. The position of the bodies, with arms wrapped around one another, would suggest this. But I tend to think it was a suicide out of desperation rather than infectious fatalism. When they entered their suicide pact, Pinbacker had already effectively taken over the ship and destroyed the computer AI. Consequently the remaining crew members had no hope of completing the mission, even if they could put a stop to Pinbacker's murderous ways. Instead of facing a monster inside a darkened ship, they chose to go out the way they did -- or at least that's my impression.
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Post by nyspaceman on Aug 12, 2007 21:36:42 GMT -5
Thanks nimue. Spc, check out this photo of the Icarus I crew: www.sunshinefan.com/gallery/displayimage.php?album=3&pos=80 There are five, two of whom were erect, like they were facing down (or surrendering to?) the sun. You know, Science Fiction such as "Sunshine" really get me to wonder about the current state of religion -- indeed, the age-old state of it. I am someone personally very interested in Islam, and I have found the Koran to be an extremely profound text, especially because it is constantly exhorting the reader to utilize his or her reason, and identifies everyday human activities, nature, and vast space itself as miracles and signs of God's existence and goodness. Yet, history of Islam has been, in my mind, a nearly constant denial of the creed's very scripture. It is mindboggling. On another random note, I find it interesting how the various characters in this movie seem to reflect the character (in simple terms) of their respective nation. Kaneda, Japanese, detached and committed to the group; Corazon, Chinese, possibly Taoist, devoted to cultivation and nature; Trey, possibly Viet Namese, reflective of a more Confucian focus and intellectuality; Cassie, Mace, and Harvey, the Americans, reflective of our spectrum, from open to our emotions to industrious pragmatism to dangerously self-interested; and Capa, I suppose the Briton, steadfast, determined, and optimistic. Just some thoughts... -Chris
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Post by nyspaceman on Aug 12, 2007 21:37:48 GMT -5
PS And Pinbacker, the Russian, clearly an example of mysticism gone awry, to the point of violent fatalism.
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Post by nimue on Aug 14, 2007 4:36:02 GMT -5
I think Capa was supposed to be American on this one. I'm not sure but I think I read it somewhere.
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Post by brittany on Aug 14, 2007 8:48:13 GMT -5
I think Capa was supposed to be American on this one. I'm not sure but I think I read it somewhere. Yes he is American. It's in his backstory which can be found on SFO or SunshineDNA.
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Post by nimue on Aug 14, 2007 11:34:00 GMT -5
Yeah... that's where I read it!
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Post by sunshinedna on Aug 14, 2007 11:46:20 GMT -5
Capa and Cassie become a New Adam and a New Eve, and Pinbacker a New Serpent. Unlike the originals, they are not fooled by the lies and delusions of the latter, instead choosing, fighting for, and, ultimately, renewing life. Very interesting... very, very interesting. Do you remember the shot of Cassie at the end 'overseeing' the ship as it descends into the Sun...? The ship 'hanging' from a golden 'teardrop'? That shot was spoken about endlessly as well as being pre-visualised. One version had a teardrop falling and then 'orbiting' around the ship. Another had a blooddrop doing the same... I always found that shot of Cassie to represent her as the 'Mother Earth' - it's the moment just before she - ooops spoiler: ...just before she runs to save Capa from Pinbacker (tearing off his skin in the process ). If she hadn't done that Earth wouldn't have survived... she is equally as responsible for saving the Earth from Pinbacker's destruction as Capa... So, I think your theory fits that quite nicely! Cool!!
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Post by nimue on Aug 14, 2007 21:08:58 GMT -5
Eve was told to be responsible for Adam's downfall as well as her own - eventually damning mankind. Cassie, as the new Eve, has done the opposite. She was responsible for saving Capa - and eventually saving mankind. Redemption and vindication for humanity brought about by the New Adam & Eve.
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Post by nyspaceman on Aug 22, 2007 22:03:56 GMT -5
Hey! Turns out that this post is still alive. It suddenly vanished from the "About" section. Another thought about Capa: what if was supposed to embody the eros (erotic) drive -- the unyielding instinct to create? He always seemed to be motivated by slightly different concerns than the rest of the crew. Certainly, he wanted to save the world; but more than that, he wanted to give birth to a new star. I'm curious if the other characters might represent various different Freud-Jung drives. Pinbacker, the thanatos (death) drive; Mace, the logos (logical) drive; Cassie, the anima (life-giving) drive; and so on. Everyone's thoughts?
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Post by chero on Aug 22, 2007 22:21:57 GMT -5
Hey! Turns out that this post is still alive. It suddenly vanished from the "About" section. Oh yeah, sorry about that! I moved this thread to the "Characters" section since it was analyzing characters and such. A very good read I might add.
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Post by nyspaceman on Aug 22, 2007 22:28:17 GMT -5
Thanks, Chero!
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Post by nimue on Aug 23, 2007 22:27:05 GMT -5
Hey! Turns out that this post is still alive. It suddenly vanished from the "About" section. Another thought about Capa: what if was supposed to embody the eros (erotic) drive -- the unyielding instinct to create? He always seemed to be motivated by slightly different concerns than the rest of the crew. Certainly, he wanted to save the world; but more than that, he wanted to give birth to a new star. I'm curious if the other characters might represent various different Freud-Jung drives. Pinbacker, the thanatos (death) drive; Mace, the logos (logical) drive; Cassie, the anima (life-giving) drive; and so on. Everyone's thoughts? Nice. We've been discussing a lot of how Sunshine is philosophically and you've presented how it is psychologically. I think that your correct seeing as Garland also made this to be psychologically-inclined as well.
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Post by neiru2012 on Aug 24, 2007 0:02:05 GMT -5
I don't mean to backtrack on the topic, but I just recently got the Sunshine script book, and thought the alternate ending scene with Cassie in the book supports the Pinbacker-as-Serpent idea. It's about when the sun breaks through the walls of the bomb:
"Cassie - seeing the Sun as if seeing God, and smiling. Pinbacker - seeing God and screaming."
Thought it was interesting, considering Pinbacker sees himself as an agent of God.
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